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Q:
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Prey Size: Western Hognose and Kenyan Sand Boa
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In Relation To:
Copperline
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I am seeking some advice about my Western hognose and Kenyan sand boa. When should I bump them from double pinks to fuzzies? I follow the Munson plan for my corns, but haven't found any comparable plan for the other species. Thanks for any suggestions.
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Assisted Answer
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3/17/2010 8:04:51 PM
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shellboa
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There's a plan?..I just feed what they seem comfortable eating. If I offer something larger than what they want and they don't eat it, I bump it back down. If I give them bigger and they are looking ok or for more than I keep going. I have 4 Kenyans right now and they are a year apart in pairs. The oldest female is huge, she will small mice or fuzzy rats, the other pair both eat hopper mice. The older male however still wants his fuzzy mice and will occasionally eat two but mostly sticks to one. Needless to say he is still a little bugger and is smaller than the two younger ones.
My hog is a little male and like his hopper mice.
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Member Comment
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3/17/2010 8:44:10 PM
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Artistry Exotics
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If a fuzzy isn't going to leave a huge lump, I'd say it's time for fuzzies. My rule of thumb is to feed a prey item that's about 1-1.5 times wider than the snake.
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Member Comment
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3/18/2010 9:29:06 AM
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JohnJohn
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I agree with Shellboa. Feed them what they will eat.
I've been trying to bump up my JCP from rat pinks to rat fuzzies. He's currently chowing down two rat pinks a week. He's definitely large enough for fuzzies now, but he just won't touch them! He seems to be afraid of them. I've tried to resist too much "tease feeding" with them because I don't want to make the problem worse. I even wondered if it was the nakedness vs the fur, even thought about getting out a razor and shaving a fuzzy! Anyone here ever shave a fuzzy???? I'm hoping that one day he will just decide that fuzzies look like food.
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Member Comment
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3/18/2010 1:30:57 PM
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FyreFocks
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I fed my kenyans whatever would leave a lump.
My hognose get a more strict diet, the young ones anyway. Prior to a year of age, i feed them smaller prey items that dont leave a bump. But i feed them every 3 days exactly. They have an awesome metabolism and this form of power feeding seems to work best. I reference www.extremehogs.com a lot.
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Member Comment
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3/18/2010 1:52:49 PM
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shellboa
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Nate-power feeding hogs shortens their life span. and Kenyans don't need a lump!
John- I have never shaved a fuzzy however I HAVE shaved a guinea pig (I have pictures)
Leaving a huge lump is not always a sign of having fed well especialy with a small slender snake. In the wild in those pictures you see with the animal having a huge bulge in its belly, thats because they eat that huge meal and then crawl off some where to digest it for like 3 months until they eat again. In captivity they are offered food on a regular basis and have no need for huge belly lumps. This can lead to obesity and organ disorders. Feed an avearge size prey item and call it good. Then feed them again in a few days. Your snakes will be healthier and live longer if you do.
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Member Comment
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3/18/2010 3:50:08 PM
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FyreFocks
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Michelle, ive considered all that, but my animals, especially the hogs, will go off feed whenever they dont want food. Sometimes they only skip a week, and sometimes they skip a month. They seem to know whats best for them, so i dont mind the feeding regime that i use for either species.
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Member Comment
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3/18/2010 8:29:28 PM
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treetrunkchris
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i dont have any sands or hognose but i feed all my snakes till it leaves a little bump in them. about 1 1/2 times the size of their thickest part. sometimes larger, but not too large. if your feeding it mice pinkies i would switch to rat pinkies and go up from there. rats have twice as much nutrients as mice.
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Accepted Answer
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3/24/2010 6:30:54 PM
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JackAsp
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I actually prefer to stay with mice, as opposed to pinkie rats. Pinkies and fuzzies are extremely fatty, and their skeletons don't have as much calcium as older rodents. Rats are higher in protein (and, unfortunately, fat,) gram for gram, than a mouse of comparable age, but "twice as much" is stretching things. Rats are good feeders once you're on at least the hopper level. Before that they're close enough to get by on if that's what's available, but nutritionally they're a little over-rated.
There's a good argument for starting on pinkie rats if it's a big honking species that you really can't afford to have fixated on MICE when it grows up (I had a female coastal carpet for 20-odd years that wasn't put on rats soon enough, which was a pain in the ASS) but for little hogs and sands I say that any fuzzy is better than any pinkie, and any hopper is better than any fuzzy. When the snake's big enough for rat hoppers, then rat versus mouse becomes a better question, I suppose. But hogs are more fat-sensitive than most of the rodent-eating colubrids, so for them I'd still lean toward mice.
They seem to be nutritious enough. My western is three feet long (and trust me, many captive mouse-fed hogs are even bigger than her; some of those old Audabon records really need to be updated!) and as thick as my 6.5' bullsnake. (The bull's young still, so he'll no doubt eventually outgirth her, but it hasn't happened yet.) That's from eating mice every five days until she was about two years old. These days she eats the same sized meals she did at two years, but less often because she's grown, and she maintains excellant strength, mass, "sinewy-ness" and energy. If I feed her as much as I used to, now that her metabolism is a little bit slower, she sometimes gets hair impactions, so once I got hip to that I adjusted the schedule. Every ten days for a full-grown snake that doesn't have to breed or brumate is, at least in her case, plenty. Some of my other species would disagree.
When she was growing, I went with about 20 per cent of her pre-meal body weight every 5 days, including during shed cycles, up until she was about a year old. Then, it went down to about ten per cent, every six days, for the next year. Since then about ten per cent every 10 days, skipping meals before sheds, seems to suit her better. Actually, it's possible her meals these days are an even lower percentage than that, but she's too big to feed in a container on top of the scale like I used to, so while I still know how many grams the mice are... I've gotten kind of lazy about weighing the actual snake.
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Member Comment
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3/24/2010 6:37:12 PM
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JackAsp
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Basically, if you think it might be time for fuzzies, just go ahead and buy a big bag of fuzzies. The first bag of a hundred fuzzies I bought with my hognose had every size in it from 2 grams to 10 grams. So I just divvied them up into a bunch of marked ziplocks and started with the small ones. As little ones ran out, the snake grew anyway. After that, I did the same thing with hoppers.
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Member Comment
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3/29/2010 4:10:14 PM
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MasonDixonReptiles
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In my experience, the hognose need slightly smaller sized prey than you'd think given their size. The opposite is true for the KSB's. They can take slightly larger sized prey than you'd think. My male KSB didn't start growing flat out until I upped his prey size... then he really started growing!
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Member Comment
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4/13/2010 11:37:10 PM
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LeoNik
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I like to stick to the rule of not feeding my Kenyan any thing that is bigger than the thickest part of her body, but I also offer more than one mouse at a time.
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