iHerp Answers: Are compact fluorescents really bad for your bearded dragons?

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Are compact fluorescents really bad for your bearded dragons?

Posted By:

deathscythe801

Calling all experienced lizard keepers! I recently noticed one of my six beardies had a little crust on her eye, similar to "sleep" we humans have when we wake up in the morning. I isolated her from her two other female cagemates, they all reside in a 48" long x 30" wide x 36" high mesh cage. All my herps are kept in my "reptile room." The average day temps are 82-84 and night temps are 72-74. Basking temps in the cage are 95-100. All adult beardies are fed a mixed green salads (collard, mustard, kale, yellow squash, etc.) daily with gut loaded crickets given approx 3-4 times a week. Calcium and vitamin supplements are included with crickets and salads. I currently have no other issues with any of my other beardies. This troubled female is still eating and pooping regularly.

Upon researching this problem, I found an abundance of negative information on the compact fluorescents. I have used the Exo-Terra Repti Glo 10.0 compact fluorescents bulb on some of my cages for a couple of years now and have seen no ill effects. From what I have found, the curved shape of the bulb can harm the dragon's eyes . . .? I have also read that the repti-glo series should not be used and only the repti-sun . . .? I have been keeping bearded dragons for close to six years now and have never heard of this before. If anyone can shed some light on this issue, it would be greatly appreciated.


Points:	250
Topics:	General Health , Eyes
Species:	Lizards > Lizards > Pogona vitticeps
Administrative:	Show/Hide

Member Comment

7/3/2009 3:50:40 PM

jenerallizationn

I had an issue earlier this year with my beardy and a compact fluorescent. I had switched from a 10W tubing to the 10W compact and and noticed that my baby would keep his eyes closed almost constantly and he was really lethargic. After a few days a vessel of some sort in his eye popped and was bloody. I had to take him to the vets but they couldn't find anything wrong with him. I switched the light back to tubing and the problem went away. From prior experience i would definately go to tubing, if not switch down to a 5W compact instead of 10. I've done a lot of research on this issue as well after having the same problem myself, and I would never reccoment a compact, at least not a 10W because they are far too strong. How much distance is between the basking spot and light? You could also try propping the light up somehow so it's not as close.

Member Comment

7/3/2009 4:55:31 PM

Krestie Kate

I second the comment above. I had the same problem with one of my iguanas. He deleoped horrible skin problems. He couldn't shed in full it was hard and nasty. I switched him to regular tube lights and the problem went away.

Member Comment

7/3/2009 9:36:02 PM

Joseph Jenkins

There was a bad list of compacts, i forget which ones were on the list, but i don't think exo-terra was on it. I have never had problems with them, but i now mostly use the mercury vapors.

Member Comment

7/3/2009 9:38:24 PM

Joseph Jenkins

oh, and i don't think the eye crust has anythin to do with ur bulbs.

Accepted Answer

7/4/2009 1:25:15 AM

Izzy

Even though the wattage is the same from the tubing to the compact, you're going to encounter problems with the compact, and I would stick with the tubing. Here is a pretty conscise explination I found... It has to do with Fluorescents and headaches in people, but the crossover is applicable to eye problems in reptiles also...

Curtesy of: http://www.classbrain.com/artteensb/publish/compact_flourescent_bulb_headaches.shtml

Industry experts acknowledge that day-to-day exposure to older, magnetically ballasted long tube fluorescent bulbs found mostly in industrial and institutional settings could cause headaches due to their noticeable flicker rate. The human brain can detect the 60 cycles per second such older bulbs need to refresh themselves to keep putting out light.

However, modern, electronically ballasted CFLs refresh themselves at between 10,000 and 40,000 cycles per second, rates too fast for the human eye or brain to detect. “As far as I’m aware there is no association between headaches and the use of compact fluorescent lamps,” says Phil Scarbro of Energy Federation Incorporated (EFI), a leading distributor of energy efficiency-related products—including many CFLs.

But Magda Havas, an Environmental & Resource Studies Ph.D. at Canada’s Trent University, says that some CFLs emit radio frequency radiation that can cause fatigue, dizziness, ringing in the ears, eyestrain, even migraines. You can test to see if CFLs in your home give off such radiation, she says, by putting a portable AM radio near one that’s on and listening for extra static the closer you get. She says that such electromagnetic interference should also be of concern to people using cell phones and wireless computers.

Sometimes headaches are due to eyestrain from inadequate lighting. When replacing an incandescent bulb with a CFL, pay attention to the lumens, which indicate the amount of light a bulb gives out (watts measure the energy use of a bulb, not the light generated). A 40-watt incandescent bulb can be replaced by an 11-14 watt CFL because the lumen ouput is approximately the same (490); a 100-watt incandescent can be replaced by a 26-29 watt CFL, both providing about 1,750 lumens. If you’re still skeptical, replace a 40-watt incandescent with a 60-watt equivalent 15-19 watt CFL, which will boost lumens to 900.

Another consideration is color temperature (measured in degrees “Kelvin”). CFLs rated at 2,700 Kelvin give off light in the more pleasing red/yellow end of the color spectrum, closer to that of most incandescents. Bulbs rated at 5,000 Kelvin and above (usually older ones) give off a less pleasing white/blue light.

Member Comment

7/4/2009 3:40:01 AM

Joseph Jenkins

The problems being experienced in beardies have to do with the output of certain levels of light, not flickering. Symptoms aren't headaches. They are popped blood vessels, closed eyes, and blindness.

Member Comment

7/4/2009 4:19:17 AM

Joseph Jenkins

Here is a link to an extensive study done on this problem:

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/phototherapyphosphor.htm

The problem bulbs appear to be Zoomed and R-zilla, but they have since then fixed the problem.

IMO, as long as 2 things are done, one can prevent this problem:

1. Leave the light on for 125 hrs before using on ur reptile, this will decrease the first "burst" of output by the bulb CONSIDERABLY.
2. Keep the bulb 5-8 inches away from the closest place ur pet's head can be.

As long as those 2 things are done, and since they have reformulated the bulbs, your reptiles should be perfectly fine no matter what compact u use.

Also, exo-terra has had no recalls or bad reports on their compact fluorescents(to my knowlege). Exo-Terra's Compact UVBs are the only compacts the petshop I work at will carry because of this.

Your exo-terra bulb IS safe.

Member Comment

7/4/2009 4:10:23 PM

Izzy

Joseph. The first part of the article was about flickering, and the second part about light levels. Though, I am certain you know that since you read the entire thing, being all of four paragraphs and really, just an overview. Trust me. If your light levels in your home were not correct, and your vessels started bursting in YOUR eyes, you'd have one screaming heck of a headache.

IMO, you shouldn't have to run ANYTHING for over five days strait before it's "safe" enough to use in an enclosure. By doing so, you've completely counteracted any energy saving benefit from the compact in the first place. Not to mention the worry about having something safe for your animal.

just my $.02

Member Comment

7/4/2009 4:29:10 PM

magsj387

Keep in mind that Bearded dragons aren't the "desert" dwelling animals that the industry has painted them out to be. They come from a similar area of climates that can be found in the US. No where does it really reach the intense UV output that would be found in a desert environment that would be typical of a uromastyx. So I'd say the 10.0 is a bit overkill...

Member Comment

7/5/2009 2:32:41 AM

Joseph Jenkins

I said i would do it as a preventative, but many bulb manufacturers already do the 150 hr burn period.

BTW, ur symptoms and problems that u posted in ur article have nothing to do with what is happening with the reptiles that are having problems with the uvb bulbs. Flickering is not causing the problems, and neither is radiation. The problems are outputs and the phosphor mixture in the bulbs that were formulated for the reptiles, and therefore, the formula isn't used in the houshold bulbs u r talking about.

Maybe u should read the link i posted to see the reasons the ACTUAL REPTILE compact bulbs are having problems instead of drawing conclusions from studies done on completely different bulbs. The chemical make-up of reptile bulbs and industrial bulbs are no where near the same.

The link i posted is a website that has devoted many many many hours of study and research to testing these reptile bulbs.

Member Comment

7/5/2009 2:35:05 AM

Joseph Jenkins

also, these bulbs have nothing to do with energy saving. They are necesary to keeping many reptiles healthy.

Member Comment

7/7/2009 11:59:47 PM

jetmech

The issues with the power compact bulbs WAS that they were emitting too high a level of UV light, and in the incorrect spectrum. ZOO-Med and R-Zilla both buy the exact same bulbs, they just put their own logo on them. They have re designed the bulbs, using different ballasts and a different phosphor compound, eliminating the issues that plagued these bulbs. The problems never had anything to do with the 60 Hz. Every bulb available in the world, (with the exception of larger aircraft, which use 400 Hz), operates on 60Hz. That is the frequency that the AC current in buildings operates on. It simply means that the electricity switches from + to - 60 times a second.As for burn in, most higher quality bulbs require some operation before they hit their peak. This is especially true in metal halide lights used in reef aquaria, Mercury Vapor bulbs in reptiles, and power compact bulbs used in all types of lighting applications. All PC bulbs use less power than their incandessant counterparts, and they are designed to put out more light per watt, run longer, and at a cooler temp. These lights have really gotten a bad rap in the herp world, but have been used with great success in the aquarium world for over 15 years. I really hope they catch on, as they are a great product! Hope this cleared up stuff for those interested.

Member Comment

7/19/2009 1:14:18 PM

Joseph Jenkins

thank you jetmech, that is what i thought, so their new bulbs are safe, right?

Member Comment

7/19/2009 5:31:44 PM

jetmech

From what I have heard and read the problems have been resolved.

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