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Raising Baby Cresteds: Fail

Posted By:

aaron

In Relation To:

[CG01]

Well, I thought they were doing just great.

I had been feeding a mix of applesauce and CGD, and just two days ago, they were sprightly and fine. Today, both of them are dead.

I'm really bummed, and beating myself up.

Although I should mention, I think I have poison in the well... my local water (I believe) has killed off my baby chondros this year, and for them I'd switched to spring water. The water here is really kinda rough, but I don't know that that's it with these guys.

I really don't know what it was... they were fine.

Also, for cresties that don't eat, how long can they live out of the egg without food? Seems I'd be out of the window, but...?

I have two more eggs incubating, so I need some redemption.


Points:	150
Topics:	General Health , Feeding
Tags:	Crested, Dead
Species:	Lizards > Geckos > Correlophus ciliatus
Administrative:	Show/Hide

Member Comment

4/22/2010 8:10:01 PM

FyreFocks

I dont know about the applesauce. I thought CGD was good on its own. Someone else will chime in.

Did you watch them eat? Or perhaps help them to make sure they were eating?

How did they do with their sheds? Did they have any trouble?

Assisted Answer

4/22/2010 8:11:28 PM

Aimee

ugh. I have heard of a handful of people with this problem, so you're not alone. holy stagnant water, batman, time to test the well water. your county health department should be able to hook you up with an agency who can do the testing, probably not too expensive (and well worth it if it saves you more heartache!). you should be able to get a chemical panel and a bacterial panel to identify the problem. I'm so sorry, Aaron, about your lost babies.

Assisted Answer

4/22/2010 9:31:30 PM

kfethe

innvest in a ro/di filter with a uv sterilizer. they sell them for salt water tanks but they will work for anything. the ro/di part takes out chemicals and heavy metals and the uv will kill any bacteria.

Author Comment

4/22/2010 9:52:27 PM

aaron

I used to be a salt / reef guy, and have used ro/di in the past...
Spring water is all that's going in that room from now on, so that's really not the issue any longer.

Looking for tips on getting them to eat / making sure they are eating, and problems/solution when rearing.

Nate, I fed them a little off the finger on Tuesday, they licked, but they're not really a "see them eat" kinda animal... I *never* see my adults eat, and they're doing just fine. :(

Member Comment

4/22/2010 10:13:31 PM

FyreFocks

Aaron, i never saw the adults eat when i kept them in the past either. But for the few babies ive bought, i normally feed them off the finger once or twice a week for the first few weeks just to be sure they ingest something.

Being a chondro guy, you probably dont need to be reminded that hydration is key.

Member Comment

4/22/2010 10:16:35 PM

Ihkura

Drop the applesauce and use it only as a treat, CGD is a complete diet and the applesauce's sugars throw that balance off. I don't believe this is what caused them to pass away, however. I recently lost one of my own hatchlings and we believe it was "failure to thrive". The only thing wrong with it was that it was dehydrated, even when water was present. It was seriously depressing, but I'd done everything I could.

Crested gecko hatchlings generally don't eat food for about a week, although I've had some start eating on the third day. Just mist them the first week, and offer food in a bottle cap on the third day onwards, that's been working great for me. If you start to get worried, you can always "introduce" them and teach them that the crested gecko diet is, indeed, food and not good-smelling mud. I do that by dabbing a drop or two on one nostril, which stimulates them to lick their noses clean. Some hatchlings I had to hand feed for a couple of weeks because they refused to eat on their own, others took to CGD straight from the get-go.

Author Comment

4/22/2010 10:40:37 PM

aaron

I used the applesauce to entice them to eat, as I have not really had time to work with them (and presumed that everything was fine, as they were alert two days ago, and looking not emaciated). By far, it would be the lesser of evils (I hear time and time again about them not taking CGD from the start, and didn't want to kill them because banana scented mud wasn't native enough).

It's strange they both died at the same time, maybe it got too hot in the snake room today (high 70s, *maybe* low 80s, but unlikely)... also strange, but when I went and took care of the chondros tonight, one was alive, although barely... I put him in a tub with shallow water, but nothin'.

Let my proclamation go out: Raising chondros is easier than raising cresties.
*gavel*

Member Comment

4/22/2010 10:43:25 PM

FyreFocks

Thems fightin' words!

But not with me.

Member Comment

4/22/2010 10:56:51 PM

abi21491

Doubt it got too hot - my room where my babies and all other reptiles are can get up to 84 at times and I haven't lost anyone *knocks on wood*. I also think the applesauce should be left out, but like someone else said I don't think that killed them. How was their humidity? What size cages did you have them in and what about bedding? Sorry for your loss Aaron.

Accepted Answer

4/22/2010 11:08:01 PM

Carusima

My reptile room is 80-84 and I have had two cresteds, from babies to adults, without a problem in there. I always mix my CGD with some sort of babyfood, whether it's banana, pinapple, or peaches. I use organic, to reduce non-natural sugars. They tend to take to them easier, and sometimes it is hard to start baby Cresteds on CGD. I've never had to try and get my babies to eat using my finger (I've had more than these two). I don't use applesauce because of the sweetness and sugars in it though, and mine tend to prefer pinapple or peaches anyways. Pretty much any forum you look on, it's about 50% 50% babyfood/CGD or just CGD, even high end breeders still use babyfood with it, so it's not bad for them.

I'm pretty sure, since you've experienced this problem several times, it's the water. Just in case I just buy a couple gallons of spring water and use that instead of tap.

Member Comment

4/22/2010 11:13:01 PM

Nicky2303

I dont really know much and i have heard not to feed baby food cause it can make them over weight, but for babies i dont see why it would be an issue gaining weight is good for them, also if u use baby food i heard not to get ones with citrus in it, something like that, lol

Member Comment

4/22/2010 11:14:14 PM

abi21491

On all of the gecko forums I'm on, everyone will crucify you for using babyfood. Of course, that's not the organic stuff - but I've found baby geckos start perfectly fine on CGD alone and I don't know any big breeders who mix with babyfood. I've also heard that the new CGD is more appealing to the geckos. I'd rather my babies eat a little bit of pure CGD than a ton of a mixture of the two, myself. But what works for one may not work for others. I forgot to add in my previous post - Aaron, the amount of time I've seen people talk about geckos going without food is up to 2 weeks - but that is well-started animals so I'm not sure how long a baby would thrive without food. If your geckos were pooing, they were eating. That's usually the best way to tell.

Member Comment

4/22/2010 11:54:57 PM

magsj387

OMG! YOU USED BABY FOOD YOU EVIL MANIAC!!!! Just had to say it, LOL, sorry to hear about all your loses. I wouldn't sweat it, its hard at times and the chances that your first batch not only gets 100% hatch rate but both make it seems to be quite a stretch. I wouldn't beat yourself up on things, but a few good tips on feeding are things I've found to help get them started and make sure they realize food is good for them. The first thing that really helps is to place them in a deli cup with just a little dab of food and nothing else, hopefully they lick it up and not smear it all over. If that doesn't work, you can try like Rachel said, and dab it on their noses. I take them and just kinda plunk them face first into the food, they usually get the idea after they clean themselves a time or two. The biggest concern is to just make sure they stay well hydrated for the first few months, food they'll get over time. Hope this helps.

Member Comment

4/23/2010 12:28:46 AM

Kitishane

I'm so sorry your little ones didn't make it Aaron. I feed all of my Rhacs pure CGD, and I have not had one fail to thrive yet, so I doubt it was the food (even with applesauce mixed in).

How was the humidity in their enclosures? I have read a few times now that shed issues tend to be a big problem for hatchling cresteds, and has lead to death in some cases. Also keep in mind that I have noticed more shedding issues with some of my baby Cresteds than my baby Gargoyles, so you may need to adjust the frequency of misting based on each individual gecko.

Author Comment

4/23/2010 12:32:52 AM

aaron

>> OMG! YOU USED BABY FOOD YOU EVIL MANIAC!!!!

I know, right?
I'm sure they get plenty of CGD in the wild.

Member Comment

4/23/2010 2:37:53 AM

Nitram

sorry about your loss, would be nice to know a reason for it happening, i feel you on that
i got a 3 month old cresty ive had for about a month or a month and a half and I give him the cgd every other day. I keep him in a tub, he has a branch, he has 2 hides, one high and one low. I also give him 5-9 dusted crickests a week. I put 5 in and hold on to the rest and put them in gragually throughout the week if i see he's been housing him, dont wanna overwhelm him with insects jumpin around. lately the cgd i been making was like thick soupy like (1 part cgd 1.75 part water) and know he's been eating cause i center it in a bottle cap so you can see where he munched out on (he never eats it all, he's tiny, but that doesnt matter). today i made the cgd a little thick i dont know he will feel about it its not too rough,
good luck in the future!

Member Comment

4/23/2010 7:23:51 AM

bsharrah

I was working with these last year for the first (and last) time. Out of ten babies produced before I scrapped the project, I only lost one due to my own ignorance. Never had a problem getting them to eat CGD from the start. I housed them in one of those mini critter keepers that were about 7x4x5 with a piece of garland to climb on and lap water off of. My advice would be to keep them in something no larger than this and house them separately right from the start. You want them to easily find the food and not have to deal with competition at the food bowl. I know a lot of people will house hatchlings together but IMO that is a bad idea - I have seen them start to compete for CGD at a very young age. Keep a small bottle cap of CGD in the cage at all times, replacing it every couple of days. Mist every evening as hydration is key, especially the first couple months. When you are sure they are eating (based of defecations, not actually seeing them eat) then you can back off on having the CGD available constantly. I didn't start feeding crickets until the one I kept was 6 months old. I got rid of all the others well before then (one of the happiest days of my life).

Member Comment

4/23/2010 7:35:21 AM

BuddyB

That sucks!!
Have your water tested...seriuosly.
We found MTBE in our well water in 2006 and RO/DI and UV will not remove MTBE.
2006 is also the same year that I lost 12 out of 25 neo chondros from kindney stress/bacterial infections. The vet who did the necropsies was certain the MTBE was the main culprit.
That spring water you are using is allowed to have MTBE and other impurities...so it could be worse than your well water.
BTW you can usually receive a free water test from the local health department if you tell them you are breastfeeding.

Buddy B

Member Comment

4/23/2010 10:01:29 AM

JohnJohn

Sorry to hear your troubles! Just keep your eyes on the future and think how happy you will be when things turn your way. There will be good days ahead. No doubt.

Assisted Answer

4/23/2010 10:33:17 AM

Krestie Kate

I lost ALL of my babys last year from bad water. Now I only buy those giant 5 gallon jugs of water from wal-mart. The kind you can go and refill. It's called reveres osmosis water. So worth my .50 every time I refill. Haven't lost anything this year. Me and my vet agree that it was the water. It was very hard and would always come out white. Baby cresteds start eating about 5-7 days when they come out of the egg. On the 5th day I dap some CDG on there noses and leave them be. It only takes 2-3 licks to fill them up. Always keep babies on papertowels so you can find poo. Messing with them too much causeing stress can also kill them (IMO) What version of CGD are you useing aaron? The newest version (not sold in pet stores) Has the best growth rates and animals take it the easyest. Adding applesauce or babyfood to the crested gecko diet dose make it more tasteful but when you get the animal to start eatting it with the applesauce they will be reluctant to start eatting CGD without applesauce causeing a whole new kind of problem. Are the parents of apropriate breeding weight? The mother not getting correct nutriants can also cause health problems with the babies. If she has calcium problems that can effect egg and baby. They may have just been born under developed or hatched too soon. What temp did you incubate them at?

Assisted Answer

4/23/2010 11:44:45 AM

dalvers63

I would think it is more the water than anything else, especially if your baby chondros suffered too.

I've raised 3 babies so far on CGD alone with no issues at all. Once they hatch I keep them in small critter keepers with some plastic plants. Using 2 liter bottle screw tops for CGD and I only put a small amount in - this way I can see that they were eating.

Sorry about your babies buddy..here's hoping the next two do better!

Member Comment

4/24/2010 5:10:23 PM

Katie M

I have nothing new to offer to the situation, but want to say sorry :( Those two were very cute

Member Comment

4/27/2010 7:00:01 AM

krackerdactyl

Sorry about the loss. I've been only using cgd. And of course always with the water...

Assisted Answer

4/27/2010 3:15:55 PM

Maxrr

Sorry to hear about your loss...

How was the humidity? Did you mist them everyday? The only time I've had baby cresties die was when I wasn't able to mist a couple days in a row. They dry out real quick.

All my baby cresties end up eating CGD at some point and I don't do anything to entice them. Some just take longer than others...

Member Comment

5/11/2010 4:00:59 PM

amarilrose

Dittos to Katie's sentiment. :(

Author Comment

5/11/2010 9:00:38 PM

aaron

Also, meant to give buddy some points... sorry buddy... I will talk to the admin

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