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Q:
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Good Substrate for Tegu
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In Relation To:
Jagua
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Dear iHerp Members: The problem with all commercially available substrates? My male tegu, Jagua, like others of his species, loves to dig, tunnel, plough around in his substrate. But no mater what I've used, he eventually gets small slivers or filaments or accumulated, moistened dust of the substrate stuck along the inside of his lips, especially towards the front of his snout. Needless to say, this causes problems. I have to remove the material with tweezers. If I don't notice such imbedded material right away, a mild infection can result. I have had to treat with anti-biotic ointments. No, not talking 'mouth rot' here or anything that serious. But extracting the substrate material from his mouth can cause temporary, minor bleeding, etc. Although it seems criminal to do so, I now have him on newspapers - the old standby. He does have two large hides, one a long, upside-down planter box with holes cut in the bottom edge to permit entrance and exit. He spends much of his time inside the latter. But this is a poor substitute for digging (which is good for him, and natural for the species) and burrowing into a substrate. Even the usually recommended substrates - like the extremely expensive cypress mulch (which around here one has to order!) - or coconut fiber, etc., cause the same problem with his mouth. I've tried aspen shavings, even the bark offered by ZooMed. This last was a desperation measure, and I was resistent to using anything that contained fir tree resins - depite ZooMed's personal assurance through emails that their bark substrate was safe for a tegu. The same problem occurred shortly after I tried using it: tiny strands of the bark were forced/crammed into his lips during burrowing. Making sure the correct humidity is present does not help. In fact, if any portion of the substrate itself is too moist, this alone can exacerbate the problem. I hesitate to use dirt for two reasons. Obviously, 1) dirt is a mess and 2) it's very hard to find dirt that is genuinely "clean" of potentially dangerous parasites, micro-organisms, pesticides/fungicides, etc. I've had "organic peat soil" recommened (as opposed to peat moss or sphagnum), but the cost is truly prohibitive. Any ideas? Thank you! Dan
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Member Comment
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9/18/2009 5:18:17 PM
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FieldTrialTrainer
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Have you tried the excavator stuff specifially for herps? I forget who makes it. It's a clay type stuff used for burrowing. I've never used it but have heard people that love it. Maybe check into that?
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Author Comment
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9/18/2009 6:13:28 PM
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magisterdraconus
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Thank you for that idea. I will look into it; also appreciate the compliment on my Spiny-Tailed Iguana. I'm going to HAVE to update my pics here. Guapo is now quite a big bigger, of course, as is Jagua (the Columbian Tegu). I will have to take a look at what you have...
I'm new here - or, rather, haven't used the site enough to really know what's what. They gave me the option of accepting your answer or accepting and splitting points. Don't have the faintest what that means! ;-)
Best,
Dan
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Member Comment
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9/18/2009 7:04:20 PM
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Geckofactor
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The excavator stuff is pretty expensive but it could work. I haven't used it in about a year or so but I use to get organic potting soil and mix it with play sand and it works fine and you spend all together maybe 6 bucks to fill a 55 or more gallon tank depending on how deep you really wanna make it.
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Author Comment
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9/18/2009 7:17:34 PM
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magisterdraconus
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Yes, Zoo Med excavator is 10 dollars for 10 pounds. Given that my tegus enclosure is five ft. by four ft., with an 8" drop from the bottom edge of the front sliding glass doors, I would be spending a LOT of money.
Your idea sounds very good - although I'm not sure about the sand. Maybe just plain old organic potting soil might do the trick.
Thanks!
Dan
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Member Comment
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9/18/2009 7:29:25 PM
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Geckofactor
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I've never personally had an issue with the sand soil mixture and I've kept a lot of animals that come from a sandy soil environment on it rattlesnakes, water dragons, beardies, stuff like that I kept a red tegu in it but I think most of the golds and black and whites I've kept I've just kept on newspaper after having some of the same issues you're describing or if they started to stress just used aspen but the red I kept in that mixture did perfectly well for a few years until I sold her. Either way good luck.
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Accepted Answer
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9/18/2009 7:29:28 PM
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shellboa
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I use an organic potting soil that is free of any kind of fertilizer or other junk and mix screened play ground sand with it. For my skinks, tortoises and rubber boas. I add extra moss as needed to maintain humidity. I've used the shredded coconut in a pinch as well. My savannah is on a mix of all 3 and I've not had any mouth issues tho she's not so much a burrower. I've also used beta chip or sani-chip (same thing diffferent brand) and not had mouth issues with my savannah.
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Member Comment
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9/18/2009 7:30:16 PM
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shellboa
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BTW I also use the beta chip for all of my burrowing type snakes besides the rubber boa and they do well with it also.
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Author Comment
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9/18/2009 7:52:43 PM
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magisterdraconus
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I will look into the beta chip - thank you. No idea what it is composed of, but I will find out...
Dan
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Member Comment
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9/18/2009 7:54:43 PM
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Geckofactor
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Dear lord it sounded like Michelle actually agreed with something I said where's my sharpie I need to mark this on the calandar.
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Assisted Answer
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9/19/2009 12:19:31 AM
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Herpterra
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SCOTTS potting soil has worked great for my monitors as it is free of fertilizers and easy to pass should an animals ingest some.
I would recommend Scotts for any borrowing animal as it has done me well through the years
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Member Comment
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9/19/2009 5:11:43 AM
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magsj387
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Did you say you've tried the bedabeast or ecoearth, I've never heard of any issues resulting from that, its cheep and easy to use, my tegu loved it!
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Author Comment
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9/19/2009 12:05:16 PM
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magisterdraconus
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No, I haven't tried those two; seems there are a TON of substrates out there! But I did look at the ecoearth (ZooMed, if I remember correctly?) and decided against it for some reason. I will do some research on both.
Really never heard of bedabeast!
Thank you.
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Author Comment
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9/19/2009 12:10:26 PM
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magisterdraconus
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Those (bed-a-beast and ecoearth) appear to be made of coconut fibers. So, no, they wouldn't work. The fibers would certainly get jammed up into his mouth.
I'm definitely leaning towards the soil or soil mix ideas that have been suggested.
Dan
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Author Comment
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9/19/2009 2:36:49 PM
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magisterdraconus
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Well, I've just been to four different places, where I made the poor employees open various bags of organic top soil or potting soil, and also checked out peat and sphagnum moss, etc. In every case, wood slivers, strands, filaments, etc., were present, which means all would cause a problem for my tegus mouth.
Some alternatives that might work, like Excavator from ZooMed, are way too expensive, as I require fairly large quantities at a time for my tegu's enclosure.
Looks like I will have to stick with newspapers.
I want to thank everyone for the help, anyway...
:-(
Dan
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Member Comment
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9/20/2009 3:06:42 AM
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EricIvins
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Dirt...........It's been used by serious hobbyists and breeders for 30+ years..........its track record speaks for itself...............
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Member Comment
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9/20/2009 1:41:16 PM
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FieldTrialTrainer
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shell what about the stuff you have in the beardies tank? would that work for the tegu?
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Author Comment
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9/20/2009 7:55:10 PM
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magisterdraconus
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I'm giving dirt a try, everyone. Thanks for all your input.
Lots of responses in favor of dirt. AND the true, large-scale breeders, like Bert L. at Agama International, all say dirt. So I'm giving it a try. If it doesn't work and he still has mouth trouble, he'll just have to be on newspaper.
Being in the city, I had no good topsoil ready at hand. So I went to the nursery and found Kellogg's/Gardner and Bloome Natural Organic Topsoil. Quite cheap (on special, actually); 4 cubic feet for undere $15. That's four pretty good sized bags. I'll let everyone know whether it works or not.
Best,
Dan
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Member Comment
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9/21/2009 1:15:17 AM
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shellboa
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I use millet for the beardies, not sure that would work for a burrower...
Ken, I have a sharpie you can borrow...
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Member Comment
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9/21/2009 12:03:36 PM
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FieldTrialTrainer
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Oh yeah duh... burrowing. My thought was on the mouth thing again, ahhh
Good luck Dan!
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Author Comment
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9/21/2009 12:15:06 PM
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magisterdraconus
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Thank you... Unfortunately, it now appears ALL commercially available potting soil and topsoil is heavily mixed with what the wood product industry has found a good outlet for: decomposing sawdust and wood chips, etc.
Even the one I just bought, despite the seller's claim to the contrary, is loaded with wood slivers. The only one which may not is Scotts Premium Topsoil, recommended by someone here. BUT... that is not available in my area.
Bert L. of Agama International told me to go out in the country and dig up some dirt! He was not concerned with possible parasites, microorganisms, etc., in such soil. I may have to actually resort to this!
Dan
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Member Comment
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1/17/2011 7:23:15 AM
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abi21491
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This question has had no activity for 14 days and will be closed by an administrator unless the original poster takes action.
Recommended Action: Points awarded
An administrator will select responses and assign points at their discretion.
Original poster, please close this question out and assign points. If you have any further information in the resolution of your problem, please post it here so that others may learn from it.
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